Talk:France

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
edit·history·watch·refresh Stock post message.svg To-do list for France:

Edit Request - Geography Section

"Metropolitan France extends from the Mediterranean Sea to the English Channel and the North Sea, and from the Rhine to the Atlantic Ocean; due to its shape, it is often referred to in French as l’Hexagone ("The Hexagon"). France is one of only three countries (with Morocco and Spain) to have both Atlantic and Mediterranean coastlines."

Portugal also has Atlantic and Mediterranean coastlines, the Algarve region has it's southern border with the Mediterranean while the whole country has it's western border with the Atlantic.

João Galamas (talk) 20:52, 13 October 2015 (UTC)

I suggest to delete the above edit request. Portugal doesn't have a southern mediterranean coastline, the mediterranean is east of Gibraltar.87.212.145.228 (talk) 22:16, 29 November 2015 (UTC)

Edit Request - Law section:

"France is tolerant of the LGBT community. Since 1999, civil unions for homosexual couples are permitted, and since May 2013, same-sex marriage and LGBT adoption are legal in France.[99]"

to be removed: LGBT adoption is Legal

Same sex marriage is legal in France since may 2013 but LGBT adoption is legal, it's actually the subject of larges debates ("manif pour tous" vs "Anti Manif pour tous").


Edit Request - Literature Section: "Jean de La Fontaine is one of the most famous fabulist of that time, as he wrote hundreds of fables, some being far more famous than others, such as The Ant and the Grasshopper."he is stupid and is awesome.

Upon reading the article on "The Ant and the Grasshopper" - Fontaine was _reinterpreting_ Aesop's Fables.


Edit request

Hi, in the fourth paragraph of the introduction, there is a link that states France has the fourth largest nominal military budget, but when you click on the link the article states it has the fifth largest budget. Could someone check please.

Cheers


In the Prehistory section, it states:

"The oldest traces of human life in what is now France date from approximately 1,800,000 years ago."

Sorry, but humans have not been around than long. Wikipedia's own article on humans states they originated in Africa some 200,000 years ago, one 9th of the time stated in this article, the citation is 25 years old and is now obviously superceded.

Plus one: +1 : this is assertion in not only completely stupid but based on completelty outdated references. Please delete.92.144.185.233 (talk) 22:00, 4 March 2014 (UTC)


Edit request In the economy section, it says "France derives 75% of its electricity from nuclear power, the highest percentage in the world.[138]". Can someone put a better source, the source given claims that France makes 39% of electricity from nuclear, in complete contradiction with the article. France is known for bacon. Maybe this one: http://www.iaea.org/PRIS/WorldStatistics/NuclearShareofElectricityGeneration.aspx Up to date and reliable. The real figure is 73%. Liberivore (talk) 16:14, 24 June 2014 (UTC)


Edit request

The lead needs more than a single sentence on the history of France.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 18:13, 17 October 2014 (UTC)


Edit request in the Religion section

The paragraph begins with: is the Roman Catholic cathedral where the kings of France were crowned until 1825.[235] ]]

This text should be below the picture instead of in the paragraph, please correct it. 194.98.34.59 (talk) 12:30, 22 May 2015 (UTC)


Edit request - Foreign relations section

Last paragraph: "In 2009, France was the second largest (in absolute numbers) donor of development aid in the world, behind the US, and ahead of Germany, Japan and the UK.[145] This represents 0.5% of its GDP, in this regard rating France as tenth largest donor on the list."

According to OECD (http://www.compareyourcountry.org/%5C/oda?page=0&cr=oecd&lg=en) in 2014, France is listed fourth largest donor, behind US, UK and Germany. This represents 0.36% of its GDP, in this regard 12th largest donor.87.212.145.228 (talk) 21:51, 29 November 2015 (UTC)


Spoken Wiki[edit]

Languages[edit]

I am seriously disappointed by the fact that the language section only talks about French. Must I remind you that France is a linguistically diverse country.

Statistics[edit]

At the 1999 census, INSEE sampled 380,000 adult people all across Metropolitan France, and asked them questions about their family situation. One of the questions was about the languages that their parents spoke with them before the age of 5, this is the first time serious statistics were computed about the proportion of mother tongues in France. The results were published in Enquête familiale, Insee, 1999.

Here is a list of the nine most prominent mother tongues in France based on Enquête familiale.

Rank Language Mother tongue Percentage of adult population
1 French 39,360,000 86%
(note that this figure is an underestimate because people under 18 years of age were not surveyed; see note #2 below the table)
2 Germanic languages
(Alsatian, Lorraine Franconian, etc.)
970,000
(of whom Alsatian: 660,000;
standard German: 210,000;
Lorraine Franconian: 100,000)
2.12%
(of whom Alsatian: 1.44%;
standard German: 0.46%;
Lorraine Franconian: 0.22%)
3 Arabic
(especially Maghrebi Arabic)
940,000 2.05%
4 Occitan language
(Languedocian, Gascon, Provençal, etc.)
610,000
(another 1,060,000 had some exposure)
1.33%
(another 2.32% had some exposure, see notes)
5 Portuguese 580,000 1.27%
6 Oïl languages
(Picard, Gallo, Poitevin, Saintongeais, etc.)
570,000
(another 850,000 had some exposure)
1.25%
(another 1.86% had some exposure, see notes)
7 Italian, Corsican and Ligurian (Niçard) 540,000 1.19%
8 Spanish 485,000 1.06%
9 Breton 280,000
(another 405,000 had some exposure)
0.61%
(another 0.87% had some exposure, see notes)
10 About 400 other languages
(Polish, Berber languages, East Asian languages, Catalan, Franco-Provençal, Corsican, Basque, West Flemish, etc.)
as well as those who gave no response
2,350,000
(of whom English: 115,000)
5.12%
(of whom English: 0.25% of total adult population)
Total 45,762,000
(46,680,000 including those with two mother tongues who were counted twice)
102%
(2% of people have both French and another language as their mother tongue, thus, they are counted twice)

If we add up people with mother tongue and people with some exposure to the language before the age of 5 (see note #3 below), then the five most important languages in metropolitan France are (note that the percentages add up to more than 100, because many people are now counted twice):

  • French: 42,100,000 (92%)
  • Occitan: 1,670,000 (3.65%)
  • German and German dialects: 1,440,000 (3.15%)
  • Oïl languages (excl. French): 1,420,000 (3.10%)
  • Arabic: 1,170,000 (2.55%)

Notes on the table[edit]

  1. The data in the table are about mother tongues, and not about actual language practice. It states that 14% of the adult people living in France in 1999 were born and raised up to the age of 5 in families that spoke only (or predominantly) some other languages than French, it does not mean that 14% of adult people in France spoke some other languages than French in 1999.
  2. Only adults (i.e. 18 years and older) were surveyed. This means that French people born between 1981 and 1999 are not included in the survey, the mother tongue of the younger generations is more predominantly French than is the case with the older generations, because as the Enquête familiale survey explains, regional and immigrant language transmission decreases dramatically with each new generation, as French replaces the regional and immigrant languages. In the Enquête familiale survey, only 35% of parents whose mother tongue was a regional or immigrant language reported they spoke that language to their children. Thus, the 86% figure of people with French as their mother tongue is an underestimate because the younger generations whose predominant mother tongue is French are not counted.
  3. The concept of "mother tongue" may not give a complete idea of the phenomenon of minority languages in France. This is because there are many people who were born and raised in families in which parents spoke to them only (or predominantly) French, but in which some regional or immigration languages were also occasionally used. One dialects was occasionally spoken, some of these 1,060,000 people may speak Occitan as fluently as the 610,000 people who have it as a mother tongue, while some other (the majority, probably) have only a limited knowledge of Occitan. We cannot infer from this that 1,670,000 adults are speakers of Occitan, but it may be the case that the total number of people with some form of exposure to Occitan is higher than the 610,000 figure, though some of this number may have abandoned the language since then.

Edit request 3.7.2013 Population should be corrected[edit]

Estimated total population of France is 66 200 000 (1st January 2012), it should be noted that currently cited INSEE number does not include Mayotte or COM (collectivités d’outre-mer).

Source: http://www.insee.fr/fr/ffc/ipweb/ip1385/ip1385.pdf

From page four: Le champ géographique du bilan démographique de 2011 reste la France métropolitaine et les DOM, mais sans Mayotte, dont la transformation en département d’outre-mer date du 31 mars 2011. En ajoutant les 803 000 habitants des collectivités d’outre-mer et de Mayotte, la population des territoires de la République française au 1 er janvier 2012 est estimée à 66,2 millions d’habitants.

EEZ - contradicting information[edit]

The fifth paragraph says that France has the world's largest EEZ. However, under the Geography heading, it says that France has the 2nd largest EEZ.

Geography[edit]

Location and Borders[edit]

see description
A relief map of Metropolitan France, showing cities with over 100,000 inhabitants.
world ocean map showing territorial waters of France
France has the World's second largest territorial waters.

The European part of France is called Metropolitan France and it is located in one of the occidental ends of Europe, it is bordered by the North Sea in the north, the English Channel in the north-west, the Atlantic Ocean in the west and the Mediterranean sea in the south-east. It borders Belgium and Luxembourg in the north east, it also borders Germany and Switzerland in the east, Italy and Monaco in the south-east, Spain and Andorra in the south west. The borders in the south and in the east of the country are mountain ranges: the Pyrenees, the Alps and the Jura, the border in the east is from the Rhine river, while the border in the north and the north east melts in no natural elements. Due to its shape, it is often referred to in French as l'Hexagone ("The Hexagon"). Metropolitan France includes various islands: Corsica and coastal islands. Metropolitan France is situated mostly between latitudes 41° and 53° N, and longitudes 6° W and 10° E, on the western edge of Europe, and thus lies within the northern temperate zone. Its continental part covers about 1000 km from north to south and from east to west.

Geography[edit]

Location and Borders[edit]

see description
A relief map of Metropolitan France, showing cities with over 100,000 inhabitants.
world ocean map showing territorial waters of France
France has the World's second largest territorial waters.

The European part of France is called Metropolitan France and it is located in one of the occidental ends of Europe, it is bordered by the North Sea in the north, the English Channel in the north-west, the Atlantic Ocean in the west and the Mediterranean sea in the south-east. It borders Belgium and Luxembourg in the north east, it also borders Germany and Switzerland in the east, Italy and Monaco in the south-east, Spain and Andorra in the south west. The borders in the south and in the east of the country are mountain ranges: the Pyrenees, the Alps and the Jura, the border in the east is from the Rhine river, while the border in the north and the north east melts in no natural elements. Due to its shape, it is often referred to in French as l'Hexagone ("The Hexagon"). Metropolitan France includes various islands: Corsica and coastal islands. Metropolitan France is situated mostly between latitudes 41° and 53° N, and longitudes 6° W and 10° E, on the western edge of Europe, and thus lies within the northern temperate zone. Its continental part covers about 1000 km from north to south and from east to west.

EEZ is not French territory, it is international waters[edit]

The map, both the one recently added and the old one, showing all of France's territory across the globe, shows EEZ highlighted, this is misleading as EEZ is not French territory. French law does not apply here, it is international waters. Full French sovereign territory only extends up 12 nautical miles from French soil (hence this being territorial waters), though the country has limited sovereignty over the contiguous zone, going out a further 12 nautical miles. It has no sovereignty over the EEZ, but rather exclusive resource rights, this map should be removed, as it does not perpetrate to show the location of France, as claimed. Else it should be clearly captioned as to what it shows, though it's still misleading to a reader just glancing at it. Rob984 (talk) 21:16, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

This is the same problem for most island territories (For exemple List of sovereign states and dependent territories in Oceania). We have to set boundaries on the maps to see something. It's not related with the French laws or a claim. It's nevertheless more coherent to use the EZZ than the arbitrary borders that one can see everywhere, even in sources deemed "serious" (For example the famous Encyclopædia Britannica : see Encyclopaedia britannica's map of Pacific islands, the Australian department of the Treasury : see Map of the Pacific, UNESCO : see Pacific Islands (WWDR3, 2009) or the FAO : see Map of the Pacific Island countries)... For don't have any ambiguity, I specify the choice in the caption.--Monsieur Fou (talk) 13:12, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
The boundaries have to be set somewhere, sure, but if the international treaties say EZZ does not give territorial jurisdiction and the French government does not claim otherwise, the OP has a reasonable point that they should not be labelled "territory", be it for France or other countries. No big deal. TigraanClick here to contact me 13:54, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
I modified the caption by separating the two notions and clearly specifying that the territory of France is in dark blue and the EEZ in lighter blue. --Monsieur Fou (talk) 18:42, 25 January 2017 (UTC)
I can see showing EEZ is helpful in highlighting the territory, especially the one at List of sovereign states and dependent territories in Oceania where it is showing many bordering island territories. However, I wonder if there is a better way to highlight France's territory on a world map? It's actually quite hard to see France's territory on those EEZ maps, because the difference between the blue shades is so little. There are these maps on commons which are much clearer, especially the left one:
France in the World (+Antarctica claims).svg France in the World (+Antarctica claims) (+EU).svg
The recently added map is misleading because it implies all of the republic is in the EU, which it isn't (this is also a problem with the one above on the right). Alternatively, for the "in Europe" map, I think we should go back to the normal map style used for all European countries, but add inserts for overseas regions, since they are part of the EU. I.e. the first map below with inserts added like on the second map:
EU-France.svg France base map 18 regions.png
Thoughts?
Rob984 (talk) 16:10, 30 January 2017 (UTC)
This article is about France, not about France in the EU. Be careful not to over-standardize articles about the European countries; in the French constitution, the entire territory (Metropolitan and Overseas regions, Overseas collectivities and the other three territories) forms France. All the citizens of these territories are French and vote for the national elections. That's different, for example, from the British Overseas Territories, which are not constitutionally part of the United Kingdom and don't vote for the national elections. Choosing a map which doesn't represent the whole territory and present it as the territory of France would be false information, the population of overseas France is 2,718,000 inhabitants, there is no equivalent in Europe. France is mainly a European country but not exclusively an European country. A map with all the regions (overseas and metropolitan) is interesting because it's the most integrated form of collectivity but it excludes the other types of territories and Saint Martin (This is the only exception) is part of the EU without being a region.--Monsieur Fou (talk) 18:09, 30 January 2017 (UTC)
I don't disagree with anything you have said, nor is it anything I'm unaware of. But the whole point of showing metropolitan France in Europe is the significance of Europe in the first place (it's not like France is in the middle of Europe and the map just happens to show the rest of the continent), the overseas departments and Saint Martin are part of the EU, and thus are associated with Europe. The other parts of the French Republic (you can call them "France" if you like, but New Caledonians certainly don't), are not part of the EU. Your map is fundamentally wrong, the whole of the blue area is not "in" the European Union. Two maps, with different colours, is actually better at distinguishing the 18 regions of France and Saint Martin that are within the EU, from the whole of the French Republic, parts of which are not in the EU. Rob984 (talk) 19:03, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

Edit request[edit]

"Algeria and nearly all the other colonies became independent in the 1960s with minimal controversy"

Wars were fought in Indochina and Algeria against independence so I suggest to remove this sentence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Charbonnelb (talkcontribs) 03:28, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 47 external links on France. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

You may set the |checked=, on this template, to true or failed to let other editors know you reviewed the change. If you find any errors, please use the tools below to fix them or call an editor by setting |needhelp= to your help request.

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

If you are unable to use these tools, you may set |needhelp=<your help request> on this template to request help from an experienced user. Please include details about your problem, to help other editors.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 17:57, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 May 2017[edit]

Still says hollande as president, requires update for macron Johnmcnally252 (talk) 08:33, 14 May 2017 (UTC)

Already done. RivertorchFIREWATER 14:35, 14 May 2017 (UTC)

Edit request[edit]

Please add a hatnote for La France

{{redirect|la France|other uses|Lafrance}}

-- 65.94.169.56 (talk) 04:22, 8 June 2017 (UTC)

Done DRAGON BOOSTER 05:35, 9 June 2017 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 83 external links on France. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

You may set the |checked=, on this template, to true or failed to let other editors know you reviewed the change. If you find any errors, please use the tools below to fix them or call an editor by setting |needhelp= to your help request.

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

If you are unable to use these tools, you may set |needhelp=<your help request> on this template to request help from an experienced user. Please include details about your problem, to help other editors.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 17:12, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

Largest country in Western Europe[edit]

    In a quiz programme, I once heard that France is the largest country in what used to be known as the E.E.C.. If this is correct, this could go in here  - the quiz programme did make it crystal clear that it was talking about the largest country by area. Vorbee (talk) 14:40, 19 June 2017 (UTC)